She died, but her daughter lives, so we cant be too sad. or when Anna (maid) became a ladys maid.. they asked if its OK to keep calling her Anna instead of Bates.I am so confused.Thank you for your time and help.All the best,Shirley. Sorry I forgot to put this in the other posts but another aspect to consider is that a Marchioness, ranking so high, would probably be expected to dress better and overall put on a better impression than the unmarried middle daughter of an Earl. Why didnt the guards search his person when it wasnt in his bed as theyd expected? Sure, Mary endures tragedy, but Mary is also wealthy, chic, and constantly pursued by scores of handsome suitors. Hers, too, it seemed. She wont be content to let other people tell her that she cant be an unwed mother. ), and had a thing for her (yay! Mary gets whatever she wantsan archbishop to perform her wedding, her husband to accept a legacy that makes him uncomfortable so that she can live in the house she wants to, despite its impracticalitywhile everyone else gets to decide whats right for her sister Edith. Mr. Carson is Lady Mary's father. Fans Fuming Over Mayim Bialik and Ken Jennings' Hosting Schedules: "I Want Ken Full-Time". Robert is the 7th Earl of Grantham, making Cora the 7th Countess of Grantham, assuming of course that there has never been a divorce or death which has resulted in a remarriage. So Edith was alone again, naturally. There is also Violet Crawley (played by Maggie Smith) who is Lord Granthams mother and the wife of the previous Lord Grantham. Netflix's 'Money Shot' Documentary Trailer Shines A Harsh Light On Pornhub, The "Most Trafficked Website In The World", 'The Skinny Shot' on Hulu Is An Ozempic "Documentary" That Plays More Like A Commercial, Where Is Estonia Located? Neat. Hope you are doing well. PostedMarch 4, 2015 All contents 2023 The Slate Group LLC. That placed the footman in a tricky situation, but it was nothing a little poison couldn't fix, and thats exactly why some fans believe Thomas slipped something into Mr. Pamuks dinner. However I do not feel easy with the title lord because the word lord is associated with the All mighty God. Given the opportunity to be responsible for something instead of responsible to everyone, she seems remarkably at peace as this season closes. That would be nice, except it seems clear from the start of season five that Edith is sadder than ever. Stevenson: Oh that Gwen Dawson. June, how did you feel about this weeks downstairs saga? But then I keep running into the same problem-why doesn't that lady's maid come to Downton with her in the film? He conveniently falls in love with Lady Mary, eldest daughter of Robert, and their boy child George now is heir perceptive to the seat and title. P.S. Maybe you get acreage, but no title as a peer. The family refer to the housekeeper and cook as Mrs and their family name regardless if they were ever married or not. My own belief is that the Crawleys would still be there.. This theory all comes down to eyes. Since abbey means place that nuns or monks used to live, was the Downton house supposed to be a former monastary or nunnery? I guess she may not technically be a Lady's Maid but a "maid who does buttons and hooks". Other than at last finding Edith a suitable match, and either freeing or killing off Bates, remind me what were waiting on at this point? So sad that she almost burned the house down by accident. The ex-wife must now be referred to as Sarah, Duchess of York. According to this theory, the miscarriage kicks off a curse of deadly pregnancies: Lady Sybil dies in childbirth; Matthew Crawley dies in a car accident soon after the birth of his son; and when the maid Ethel Parks becomes pregnant with Major Bryants child, he dies, too. Or it could just be a sign that Rosamund cares about her niece. I hope they are all thoroughly ashamed. So lets call her Anne. Beautiful, stylish, haughty, powerful Mary should really be secure enough in her own identity that she doesnt need to diminish poor struggling Edith in order to confirm her superiority, yet she does and has continually done so during the five seasons of Downton Abbey. I still stick with my original theory-that her lady's maid isn't a full-time one like Anna, but that a housemaid might help her or she shares Bertie's mother's lady's maid. 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The only way she would gain a title is if a title is bestowed on Henry by the monarch or if she marries a person of title in later life such as has happened to Isobelle Crawley, now Lady Merton. And what about Mary? (Which, quite frankly, she already is, to these people.) 18,354, This story has been shared 11,875 times. Epic frame-job fail.). It's mentioned in series 4 (IIRC) - Lady Mary ask Anna to look after Rose while they are in London because they can't take Madge away from Lady Edith who is staying at Downton Abbey. If it is Earl of (name) (Earl of Avon, Earl of Oxford) it is almost always a place. Thank you for the explanation! After enjoying a day of fox hunting and an evening of sparkling conversation, Kemal Pamuk drops dead right in Lady Marys bed. He would almost certainly enlist, as show creator Julian Fellowes himself has suggested. Thomas has been routinely scorned for his incessant scheming and then-taboo homosexuality, but he always is allowed to scrabble back up top and hes managed to secure friendships and respect. Thanks also to Hans for the helpful comment. A parent with brown eyes might carry the recessive blue eye gene (i.e. On the one hand, Edith's story like Mary's contains a sort of gross "don't have sex when you're not supposed to or you'll pay a horrible price" lesson. She's unluckier than Matthew, and he's quite deceased. I dont know why this is so but it is the tradition. But before that, like Im the case of Mary, the senior housemaid would be an acting ladys maid. It's the. Like what you see? 4,289, This story has been shared 2,664 times. I, toosomewhat uncharitably, I realizecracked up when the ceremony only got as far as Dearly beloved, we are gathered. (This is the second consecutive Downton reception weve been cheated out of. I dont know any of this for certain but this is what I believe to be the case. In the Season 1 finale, tragedy strikes. But because Edith is Edith, he dumped her at the altar in front of her horrified family, humiliating her in front of the very people who already felt sorry for her and considered her a lost cause who would be better off as the spinster they expected her to become than as the wife of this older disabled veteran (and shame on them, by the way). Click here to subscribe to the Royal Central newsletter,
Staying Single: What Most People Do If They Divorce After 50. Set in the early 1900s, the show gives a fairly accurate idea of life for the aristocracy at this time and the changes that the first world war brought to the United Kingdoms formerly rigid class system. Both Lord and Lady Grantham have blue eyes, but their eldest daughter, Mary, has brown eyes. also to be noted a Lord of the Manor is not a peer. The new husband is required to take the family name in order to receive his father-in-laws title. Then at some point "Madge" became Edith's Lady's Maid (and Lady Rose's). After all, she has a wealthy grandmother and uncle in New York City and they arent ones for convention. It just isnt done. Lady Edith Pelham, Marchioness of Hexam (Laura Carmichael) announced that she and her husband Bertie Pelham, Marquess of Hexam, are pregnant. Thomas: Well, it looks like were being set up for another rerun: The question of what Ethel the housemaid-turned-prostitute should do with her son. Downton Pop-out Trailer.) Being American, I fear I have a rather limited understanding of the British system regarding the bestowing of titles. What We Know About Her Continued 'Today Show' Absence, Drew Barrymore and Ross Mathews Disgusted After Guy Fieri Feeds Them Spray Cheese on 'The Drew Barrymore Show', 'Jeopardy!' I have a question: under what circumstances is it correct to address someone with the title Lord/Lady and his/her first name? The valet was suspected of murder (twice). So the divorced Margaret had to settle for being styled Margaret, Duchess of Argyll. The show has always made a point of depicting her as a bitter loser, which is not only unkind, but unfair. Like the family name for the very-real premier duke of England, the Duke of Norfolk, is Fitzalan-Howard. Downton House. She is persistently tormented by an unknown feeling, a sort of vague discomfort at the knowledge of a possibly sinister presence . I understand that they are called Lord and Lady Grantham, I just dont understand why they go by Violets last name. I'm surprised, I would have thought a family that could afford it would have made sure their out in society daughters would have ladies' maids, so they could look their best as they hunt for husbands. Would he be Viscount Downton? Sadly, Sybil died giving birth to their daughter. It's probably really a case of storytelling trumping historical accuracy. And thats what I aim to explain in this article. So Georges wife would be known as the Countess of Grantham, and both Cora and Violet would be known as the dowager, unless they had to be identified apart in which case it theyd be known as Cora Crawley, 7th Countess of Grantham and Violet Crawley, 6th Countess of Grantham. 4,321, This story has been shared 4,289 times. 1. Lady's maids were often held onto even when the rest of the staff were decreasing rapidly, and a marchioness would certainly be expected to have one. It cleared up my confusion about the names and titles. The deliciously mean-spirited piling on of indignities is unjust . How dare Edith exist for something other than marriage? That will nicely counter the thermonuclear war that Thomas and Mrs. OBrien seem to be about to wage. As for Mary and Edith, they began to realize the importance of their bond as sisters. But honestly I am not at all worried about the future. Tom is the Granthams son in law, Lady Sibyls widower. Vikki Stark, M.S.W., M.F.T., is a family therapist and the director of the Sedona Counselling Centre of Montreal. I think Edith was right when she said that she and Anthony Strallan would be so terribly, terribly happy, but a campaign of undermining by the rest of her family pushed him to abandon her at the altar. She became solely Mary's lady's maid once Mary wed. After this, Mary asked Edith how the new maid was doing and Edith said that she missed Anna. The family of a Lord of the Manor have no courtesy titles, so their daughters would remain as is a Lordship of the Manor can be left to anyone and is transferred just like any other type of property and can be left in a will. The fact that Hartley doesn't seem to come to any certain conclusions is very apparent . 1 level 1 [deleted] How dare she feel jealousy for her chilly older sister? The article was so frustrating when it left that out. Edith (played superbly by Laura Carmichael) has always been the quiet rebel in the family--unlike the sprightly Lady Rose who was ready to marry a black man, partly to shock her mother--and we have been waiting for this all along since Lady Edith began her relationship with a married editor, Michael. You said the son of Lord Grantham would have been called Lord Downtown, why was this not the case for Robert when his own father was the Lord Gratham? So she is styled, for she is not a Duchess, taking her title from her husband. She's unluckier than Bates, and he went to jail for something he didn't do, for what certainly felt like a really, really long time. Brigitte Zaugg, author of the journal article "The Art of Irresolution in Edith Wharton's 'The Lady's Maid's Bell'", presents an enlightened . Maybe Edith's lady's maid is new and she doesn't quite trust her to do her best when she's going to be seeing the King and Queen. I still dont understand where the name Grantham comes from. Robert and Cora were devastated over the loss of their youngest daughter. My understanding is that the lower-ranking staff are addressed by the first name, (e.g., Daisy) and higher-ranking staff who are responsible for their area, (e.g., Mr. Carson in in charge of footmen so on, Ms. Hughes in charge of maids, and Ms. Patmore in charge of the cooks) or who work directly for the family, (e.g., Mr. Bates) or maybe sometimes I guess it could be some more familiar with some staff, (e.g., Anna starting off lower on the ladder and then moving up to waiting on a member of the family). In my mind, her happiest ending would be taking Marigold to America. When Lady Edith becomes pregnant with Michael Gregsons child, she finds a strong support system in her aunt, Lady Rosamund Painswick. English actor Laura Carmichael doesn't have a problem with that. But theres been precious little kindness shown to Edith over the years. As both are the daughters of an Earl, they use the title Lady in front of their names. Ill be awaiting them while munching on champagne-basted asparagus and Calvados-glazed duck. Any other sons would be styled as The Honourable before their first name. Maybe he'll die! If not, why don't they? What is the grandson called? 'Mandalorian' Season 3 Release Time, Savannah Guthrie Rushed Out Of 'Today' After Testing Positive For COVID-19 During Live Broadcast, 'RHOBH' Star Garcelle Beauvais Pledges That She and Erika Jayne Are "Trying to Be Open" in Season 13 After Nasty Feud, 'Real Housewives of Atlanta' Star Drew Sidora Is Finally Getting Divorced From Ralph Pittman, Selena Gomez Confesses That The "Biggest Mistake" of Her Life Involves Her 'Wizards of Waverly' Place Co-Stars, Is 'Yellowstone' On Tonight? Gladys Denker is a maid to the Dowager Countess. At times, the story of Edith has seemed needlessly sadistic, in that one eventually wonders how many ways (foiled by beautiful sister, dumped at the altar, abandoned in mystery, foiled by wife, foiled by another wife) one woman can be thumped with the giant rubber mallet of life until even the little cartoon birds flying over her head are dizzy. They wrapped up Mrs. Hughes health scare lickety splitId thought that would last all season. and our Season 4 of "Downton Abbey" introduces a major shift in plot, as well as a shift in style, evident in the fashion of the character Lady Edith Crawley, played by Laura Carmichael. 2023 Minute Media - All Rights Reserved. Theres a lot to admire about Matthews mother, who regularly steps out of her comfort zone to improve the lives of the less fortunate, but shes also more than a tad condescending. Slate is published by The Slate Group, a Graham Holdings Company. After finding Edith in London, a plan is concocted whereby the daughter Marigold will be raised in the house with the other two grandchildren already there. Downton Abbey invests a lot of time and effort in convincing us that John Bates, Lord Grantham's trusty, is a great guydespite his checkered past and multiple murder allegations. This theory all comes down to . As she has married untitled Mr Henry Talbot she is Lady Mary Talbot. Edith is justthere. Lady Mary retained her married name Lady Mary Crawley, until she remarries at which point she takes her new husbands title or name. Because Matthew predeceased Robert, Mary was never actually the Countess, but her son would be the earl, so what title does that leave her? Then she met a newspaper editor named Michael, who offered her a job writing (yay! Brush up on the best of them before the Downton Abbey movie hits theatersjust in case the whole miscarriage curse comes up. So, dear, poor Edith continues to live in terror of being discovered by the one person who should care most about protecting herher older sister. Another season of Downton Abbey has come to a close, and once again, Lady Edith is unlucky. But she wont be the same level as a Valet. Stevenson: This almost felt like Ediths supervillain origin story. Of course, this new romance was also not without turmoil. Pretend a different storyline, in which Robert has an heir, a married son. Hes the downstairs Edith. Elizabeth McGovern as Lady Cora, Laura Carmichael as Lady Edith, and Dame Maggie Smith as Lady Violet. The family name is Crawley. The title may only be passed to an heir apparent, thus a son of the current Earl, as it is always possible for heir apparent to be born to the earl even up to 9 months after his death the heir presumptive would never be given the title. However, if Crowborough was really being forced to seek an heiress in America, perhaps he was trying to cut his budget for staff and made do with a footman or butler who could do buttons and buckles when he was at home and borrowing his hosts' when he was visiting. I meant physically she might not know how to do all of the fancy hairstyles and thingsbut yes. He eventually disappears inside Germany in season 4, and later dispatches to the Crawley family imply that he was a victim of Adolf Hitlers thugs. (The show timeline places Gregson in Munich right around the time of the Beer Hall Putsch.) The two living daughters have to be addressed normally as Lady Mary and Lady Edith and by servants as MiLady and not as you said: Your Ladyship, because that is only for the countess and dowager countess. Her full title isThe Dowager Countess of Granthamand is also referred to as simpleLady Grantham. 1,143, Click to share on Facebook (Opens in new window), Click to share on Twitter (Opens in new window), Click to share on WhatsApp (Opens in new window), Click to email a link to a friend (Opens in new window), 'Wheel of Fortune' Gets Awkward as Pat Sajak Snaps at Contestant for Grabbing Wheel: "Don't Touch That", 2023 NYP Holdings, Inc. All rights reserved, Hoda Kotb's 'Today Show' Absence Finally Explained, but Her Return Is Still Unclear, 'Below Deck's Captain Sandy Hasn't Spoken to Captain Lee Since Public Feud: "I Tried To Call Him", ABC Staff Go "Zero Contact" With Amy Robach and T.J. Holmes, Encouraged to "Never Mention Their Names Again", What Time Does 'The Mandalorian' Come Out on Disney+? In season three, it looked as though Edith might finally find happiness. But on the other, there is this: In becoming a mother, Edith got out from under the thumb of her father. downtonabbey.fandom.com. Crawley is the familys surname, Grantham is their title. Mr. Bates). Then, like a phoenix from the ashes, Edith pulled herself up and began a writing career. As days go by, the bell that connects Alice's room to Mrs. Brymptom's rings at night inexplicably, and Alice hears footsteps coming from the locked door across the hall from her - the former room of Emma Saxon. She will keep her baby and she will hide it with a farming family close to Downton, damn it! Continue browsing in r/DowntonAbbey. The fifth season premiere of Downton Abbey was not kind to Lady Edith Crawley (Laura Carmichael). Why add Edith's lady's maid, who doesn't have anything really interesting to do? Brush up on the best of them before the Downton Abbey movie hits theatersjust in case the whole miscarriage curse comes up. However I like the titles of earl countess baron baroness sir lady. 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Geogre is the Earl of Granthams heir presumtive he has a title. I hope they only learn each others forenames when the vicar reads them out during the wedding ceremony. Seth Stevenson: June, you are right that Lady Mary is approaching insufferable queen bee territory. Now that the eldest girl has the same succession rights as the eldest boy in the royal family, has this affected the eldest girl of an earl or duke so they too take the highest secindary title instead of Lady + first name? She was well-known for her role as Lady Mary throughout the years and had a similar look to her character, perhaps because Lady Mary often did her best to move ahead with the times, especially with her hairstyles. Theres something evil going on in that stately home in the rolling hills of Yorkshire, and its a lot more nefarious than the re-bedding of the body of the expired Turkish gentleman. The social limitations on and the punishing of the Crawley daughters have always been central themes of Downton consider Mary's scandal with her literal death bed (the bed of death! In a bit of a confusing adjunct to this, when the wife has no title of her own, the wife of a younger son is addressed as Lady (first name of husband). The Grantham household is in turmoil. But in time her sons wife could be. SUPPORT OUR JOURNALISM: Please consider donating to keep our website running and free for all - thank you! 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I cannot resist: were the fictional Downton Abbey valet Mr. Bates to sire male issue, would the boy at some point be styled or called Master Bates?. If Robert had two sons, lets just say he named them Thomas and William. Georges mother, now Lady Mary, does not hold a title. In the case of Downton Abbey, the butler, housekeeper and Cook are Mr and Mrs accordingly and are called by all staff as such as well as among themselves. Septimus Spratt is her butler. But when George inherits, it would be proper to call him Lord Grantham. Anna used to look after all the girls. Cookie Notice If Matthew had become Earl, what would Isobel, his mother, be? Another case is that some of the Scottish Earldoms, such as the Earldom of Newburgh. Stevenson: Youre right, Dan. Thank you so much! When he became the estate agent he was an employee again and she said they could call him Branson again. 1,335, This story has been shared 1,201 times. Could you please explain when the serverants should be addressed by their first name or surename? Nothing. Read up on all the merriment there. And another sisters first sexual encounter ended in death. Grantham would likely have been the name of an estate or county or shire or some other territory given to some man named Crawley a few hundred years earlier. Apologies for posting to such an old thread, but thought I might help other confused Americans find your comment when googling, since the show is still well-known even though its finished airing. And he pretty much said, "I feel so sorry for you about your dead imaginary scandalous friend and your terrible shame that I will even lie to my wife about where I got this baby, because although it is quite a few decades early for this expression, I am picking up what you are putting down. At the head of the family is Lord Grantham,whos name is Robert Crawley (played by Hugh Bonneville). There, at the insistence of Aunt Rosamund, Edith placed her child informally not legally with some very nice Swiss people, apparently, but she almost immediately began having second thoughts. Sir Anthony Strallen wanted to marry her, but thenthe old bugger got cold feet and left her at the altar. The second and subsequent sons are styled The Honourable William. Lady Mary will always be the daughter of an Earl so she will always be known as the Lady Mary Crawley, unless she remarried, in which case shed assume her husbands styles and titles. The two living daughters have to be addressed normally as Lady Mary and Lady Edith and by servants as Mi'Lady and not as you said: Your Ladyship, because that is only for the countess and . Newspapers dont care much for proper style today. Due to the familys commitment to avoiding any unpleasantness, the only thing that could mitigate this dynamic, the intervention of the parents, does not take place. 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, Royal Family set to join Queen for Christmas at Sandringham. (Quick aside on Mr. Bates: The scene where some sort of contraband is planted in his bunk made zero sense. OK, so if Robert Crawley, Seventh Earl of Grantham, had a son he would the the Viscount Downton. And then they rolled up the rugs on Ediths before it even began.). Then, Edith got engaged to Anthony, the same guy Mary drove off once before, after convincing him she loved him in spite of his war-torn arm. Robert Crawley is addressed asLord Grantham by equals and asYour LordshiporMiLord by servants. Unlucky in love, unlucky in life. No Mr/Mrs or Miss. When Will 'Jesus Revolution' Movie Be Streaming? Oh, and she almost died in that fire. But even that uncertainty has been taken care of. (This is all leaving aside the fact that Edith's ideas about adoption seem odd, in that an adoptive family, of course, brings its own blessings, meaning the child's life is not simply devoid of joy because she cannot inherit from her birth father.). There can be an unlimited number of dowagers. She would probably have opened the house to the public in the 1960s, as so many of them did, Fellowes told Deadline. Exit Anthony, pursued by Edith's terrible luck. I feel like Ive seen all their tricks before. They hardly ever name the county explicitly in the show, just refer to the estate or the nearby towns. Or at least, Edith did. For example, Tom Branson was Brandon before he got married, then he was Tom after he married Lady C, then once he became the agent of the estate, Violet/Lady G said they can finally call him Branson again. Titles do not necessarily have any connection to the location of the owner of a title. If the Crawleys were richer they could have afforded ladys maids for all their daughters but since they cant, they settled with a senior house maid as an unofficial ladys maid for their eldest child. Last series, she was left heartbroken when Bertie Pelham called off their engagement after. I am not sure how common it was for a married woman to be in service and if the fact of being married had any impact on how they were addressed. Scan this QR code to download the app now. Takedown request | View complete answer on downtonabbey.fandom.com. Only married women have lady's maids. Shed be able to manage it on her own since she is the owner of London newspaper. For the most part, any of the staff that the family has routine contact with such as the butler, valet, footmen, chauffeur and ladys maids are called by their family name only. If so, who are they? June Thomas: Chaps, will you join me in my campaign for justice for Lady Edith? Sometimes the ex-wife wants to hold onto a title, but cannot. Another one suggests that Gregson was a British spy gathering intel on the insurgent Nazisand he might not have died at all. This story has been shared 18,354 times. Bb), but if you plot out genetic probabilities on a basic Punnett square, two blue-eyed parents with double bbs have seemingly no shot at producing a Bb baby. It is oddly her grandmother, the Dowager Countess, who seems to understand most fully that Edith's options are limited, and that this is not to be taken as a happy thing, only one the D.C. would argue cannot be changed.

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